- Author: Nevermore
- Date: August 25, 2022
- Expansion: WotLK Classic
In this guide, we’ll go over three different Talent builds for PvP Subtlety Rogue. We have one standard build, with alterations that transform it into different builds. Which one you choose will depend on what you are trying to achieve and the playstyle that you are looking to adopt.
It is worth mentioning that in all of the builds we have one talent that is subject to change depending entirely on your preference: Blood Spatter. This talent can prove to be extremely strong due to the fact that Rupture can critically strike. However, this talent is entirely optional and depends on your preferred gameplay, as you may find yourself not using Garrote or Rupture very often.
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This standard build utilizes various gameplay-enhancing effects such as Vigor, Waylay, Cheat Death and many more. This build focuses on Eviscerate damage rather than dot damage, offering improved crowd control damage due to Improved Gouge. However, this build does not benefit from high Ambush damage.
This build works exactly the same as the standard build, however, it forgoes points from Improved Gouge in favor of improved ambush damage from Improved Ambush.
This build concentrates more on bleed damage, having points in Blood Spatter instead of Improved Eviscerate and Dirty Tricks.
Improved Gouge is a talent that can be used in order to extend the duration of Gouge. This talent can be very strong for allowing you to reset fights with Stealth.
Camouflage is an extremely strong talent that negates the movement speed reduction of Stealth. This talent can prove to be mandatory due to how important movement speed is in PvP.
Master of Stealth is one of the strongest talents at your disposal, allowing you to deal 10% increased damage with the first attack made while in stealth and all other attacks made afterward for 6 seconds. This talent is extremely strong when combined with Shadow Dance
Vigor is one of the strongest talents that you can acquire — due to the nature of our class, more energy always means more abilities at our disposal.
Cheat Death is a mandatory talent as it can save us from certain death by returning us to 10% health points while also reducing all the damage taken afterward by up to 90% for 3 seconds. However, this effect can not be produced more than once per minute. This effect is extremely strong due to the fact that you can combine it with Vanish in order to reset the fight entirely.
Waylay is a talent that can help us further control our targets, not only reducing their attack speed and casting speed but also reducing their overall movement speed by 50%.
Honor Among Thieves is an extremely strong talent allowing you to benefit from your allies’ efforts, gaining a combo point each time your allies score a critical strike, either with an offensive spell or a healing spell. Sadly, this effect can’t be produced more than once per second, however, this talent proves to be absolutely mandatory in arenas.
- Glyph of Vigor increases your energy by an additional 10 (Must-have)
- Glyph of Shadow Dance increases the duration of Shadow Dance by 2 seconds (Must-have)
- Glyph of Preparation allows Preparation to also reset the cooldown of Kick, Dismantle, and Blade Flurry (Extremely good choice)
- Glyph of Cloak of Shadows allows your Cloak of Shadows to also reduce any incoming physical damage by 40% (A good choice against heavy melee comps)
- Glyph of Vanish increases your movement speed by 30% while the vanish effect is active (Must-have)
- Glyph of Blurred Speed allows you to walk on water while Sprint is active (Must-Have)
- Glyph of Safe Fall increases the distance you are allowed to negate with Safe Fall (Must-Have)
there isnt a single major glyph in my ah hows that
Some require more than 375 inscription skill to make, which is max level before Northrend
Can’t believe someone that thinks getting glyph of vigot and skipping improved ambush is making a sub rogue guide, not to mention calling frost/sub “decent”, I pity anyone who follows a lot of this, go somewhere else. And to Nevermore, go learn from glad + rogues then improve this.
I’m gonna correct myself, was in a toxic mood. I am being completely serious though. This guide has a lot of errors that will hurt new sub rogues in their gameplay. I could bring up a lot of things, but the reason glyph of vigor is bad is that you can execute all of your proper combos with 120 energy, which you will be provided with by the talent and 4 set alone. Other than that the extra 10 is useless as with proper energy management you will never go back to full energy again. This gives you the option of getting another glyph, the standard best set up is the following for major glyphs: Glyph of shadow dance, glyph of preparation and then you’re left with options depending on composition/play style -> Glyph of sprint, Glyph of Gouge, Glyph of tricks of the trade or cloak of shadows, eviscerate (more so early on for burst with lack of crit on gear), I may be forgetting one or two, but either way, those cover the most notheworthy options. You will absolutely never pass on 50% crit on ambush as vs any good player, you won’t have real pressure outside of shadow dance (with a few exceptions ofc). I could go on, but take this guide with a grain of salt, even if it does some things right and go look at multiple sources. Again, to nevermore, you need to do more proper research/get more sub rogue exp.
Hey there Silly! I am going to state a few things. First of all, there are multiple variations of the build that I have provided, one of them has Improved Ambush. If I somewhere mentioned that Frost Mage/Subtlety Rogue is just decent then I am very sorry for that misunderstanding, Rogue/Mage is one of the best comps around. About the Vigor glyph, I could say that the best Subtlety Rogues will certainly find it useless, however, this guide is not only for the “elite” and top gladiators. It is for everyone, even for those that just started the game and are newcomers to Azeroth. Such players may find it harder to manage their energy consumption properly. I do admit that I do mistakes from time to time and I am always grateful when people point them out. I always implement any changes to any of my guides that has relevance.
Just like the choice of having only one point in Master of Deception and no points in Heightened Senses, every player has the option of altering any of the builds that I provide to better fit their own play style. I have always advocated that there are multiple ways of playing this game, a proof of this would be the brand new “meta” changes such as dual-wield Unholy DK or “Bearweaving”.
I am sorry if my guide does not provide the perfect example of a Subtlety Rogue that you could encounter, but I try to always improve upon my work. I have no shame in recognizing that from time to time I do mistakes as well. I am happy that you provided some insight into a more optimized way for Subtlety Rogues.
I’m happy to hear that you’re totally fine to admit to mistakes and strive to improve, I just felt I had to give people a heads up, since even if this may be for casual players as well, with how competetive pvp is you wouldn’t want to shoot yourself in the foot (maybe that is still just me taking it very seriously, but regardless), this is still no offense to you personally really, but I do stand by my original (second) post, let’s just leave it at that, I appreciate the work that was put into creating this, even if it’s flawed, it is extremely difficult to cover all bases.
Honor Among Thieves also procs from UR OWN CRITS (ur bleed can crit)
Not taking Master of Deception and Heightened Senses is literally inting
Unfortunately the author has shown they have no idea what they are talking about with these choices, find other guides people
^^^^^^^^^^^^ this build screams i love getting opened on by other rogues