Shaman Tank
  • Author: Caperfin
  • Date: March 19, 2019
  • Expansion: WoW Classic
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About Me

I’m Caperfin. Shaman tank, Rogue Raid Tank, warlock tank and others are my forte. This guide culminates many years of work. If a topic is not addressed or you have questions, see my Livestream.

Intro

WoW Classic Shaman Icon

Can Shamans tank in WoW? The short and to the point answer is, yes. You might be rubbing your eyes in disbelief of this answer. Perhaps conjuring a ten page manifesto about how only warriors can and should tank. Although, I can go on a long rant about how there are many other classes that can tank, today, I’ll be focusing on our totemic friend, the shaman.

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The topic of viable and optimal is contentious as some don’t see the difference or mix them up and levy a misguided philosophy onto it. Optimal is the most efficient and foolproof solution that eliminates as many negative variables as possible and favors an easier path. Viable or often referred to as: possible, seen as the more challenging path but to many is a greater personal triumph. Shaman Tank is labelled as viable.

Many Shaman tanks agree their motivation is from the glory of seizing a feat the rest of the realm dares not try. If this resonates with you, please continue reading. You shaman tank if you want a challenge and a refreshing perspective from a 15 year old game. If it wasn’t obvious before, shield bearing is a sizable undertaking.

When experienced players Shaman tank and put in the effort, it shines tenfold. Shamans can fully tank 5mans, 10mans, off-tank & main-tank raids. But, this is reliant on personal and guild experience. Our overall defensive statistics won’t reach a warrior’s. However, it isn’t necessary to do so, to tank.

Race

You’ll be staring at your character for a long time. So, consider your character’s appearance as a key factor as it may entice you to play more. All races have assets but they’re minor compared to other aspects. There is no wrong race. See video to learn more about race options.

Professions

Engineering for:  Goblin Sapper Charge Masterwork Target Dummy Force Reactive Disk, etc… The second useful profession, is whatever gives the most gold on the realm. Gold helps buy potions, ex:  Flask of the Titans & consumable food, ex:  Dirge’s Kickin’ Chimaerok Chops and other items.

Threat

Iconic threat spells:  Earth Shock Stormstrike Rockbiter Weapon &  Lightning Shield. Consumable items deal threat, ex:  Major Rejuvenation Potion based on half of the Health & Mana gained. Damage items, ex: Goblin Sapper Charge deals threat equal to the damage so do reflective Buffs, ex:  Thorns. Lastly, certain items deal threat each time their Debuff is triggered, ex:  Gift of Arthas. (see threat list)

Threat Reducers

Get a threat tracker addon, ex: ThreatClassic2. Items reduce threat, ex:  Fetish of the Sand Reaver. Mage have:  Burning Soul. Shaman:  Tranquil Air Totem. Rogue and Hunter wipe threat w/Vanish &  Feign Death and so can  Flask of Petrification. Items prevent aggro:  Limited Invulnerability Potion & redirect Aggro: Masterwork Target Dummy. Classes within 30-40 yards won’t Aggro t’ill they pass the threat level of the mob’s target by 30% for melee it’s 10%. (see more)

Totems

Totems can’t deal threat for you. Common totems:  Grace of Air Totem Stoneskin Totem &  Healing Stream Totem. AoE Tanking:  Stoneclaw Totem followed by  Fire Nova Totem. To learn more, see the video.

Talents

If tanking for the first time (16/35/0), which has:  Stormstrike, it has steady threat per second for raids & excels on short fights. The other setup (21/30/0) focuses on magical damage, with:  Elemental Fury, it has many conditions to unlock its potential but thrives on long fights.

Rotations

Pre-Pull: Cast Lightning Shield. Cast Rockbiter Weapon. Place: Stoneskin Totem, Grace of Air Totem & Healing Stream Totem. Mark mobs in front of you by right-clicking their portrait, pick Raid Target Icon, pick from either a Skull = kill first, a red X = kill second, a blue square = Hunter trap or a moon = Polymorph. Pulling: Cast  Lightning Bolt, followed by as many  Lightning Bolt possible to get  Elemental Focus. Lastly,  Earth Shock.

Combat: For raids, use  Nat Pagle’s Broken Reel to assure the first few Earth Shocks hit. In a fight, use relevant ranks of Earth Shock that suits your mana & threat. Stormstrike can’t be downranked but is also used in similar cases. If  Lightning Shield expires, cast it. If death is imminent, equip a defensive weapon, ex:  Spineshatter w/ Enchant Weapon – Agility &  Rockbiter Weapon, use Masterwork Target Dummy (taunts boss), use  Juju Escape, possibly Major Rejuvenation Potion &  Major Healthstone.

Hardcore Rotations

There’s a hardcore raid rotation with great results but requires good gear, Buffs, etc… If all actions below can’t be done don’t be sad, it’s mostly to display the maximum potential possible to achieve grand feats.

Pre-Pull: Use  Unconscious Dig Rat. Remove all gear & Rank1  Lightning Bolt the rat to get Elemental Focus. Equip a gear set with a lot of spell damage & have another Shaman with a (8/8) The Ten Storms gear set cast  Lesser Healing Wave on you until you get  Lightning Shield. (see video) Once the Buff appears, equip normal tank gear and a spell damage weapon, ex:  Staff of the Shadow Flame w/ Brilliant Wizard Oil &  Enchant Weapon – Spell Power.
Pre-Pull Situational: Can also equip  Malown’s Slam & hit the rat to possibly trigger the weapon’s strength Buff. If the Buff appears, swap to your usual weapon & the Buff stays. Also, possible to get  Flurry.
Pre-Pull Situational: Someone in the party can:  Gnomish Shrink Ray the rat to give the party +250 attack power.

Pulling: Hunter pulls the boss, be on the opposite side to create the most walking distance for the boss. A second before the Hunter pulls, cast Stoneclaw Totem,  Thornling Seed, Fire Nova Totem &  Chain Lightning. Use Nat Pagle’s Broken Reel. Cast Earth Shock & swap to normal weapon+shield.
Pulling – Situational: If the first Earth Shock misses, equip a two-handed weapon w/Rockbiter Weapon & Stormstrike after swap to a normal weapon+shield.

Buffs

There’s a max of 32 Buffs, avoid nearing the max as it may lead to Buffs being removed, the addon: Buff Cap Tracker helps. Use Buff Cap Calc to see what Buffs stack. Prioritize getting defensive Buffs, ex:  Elixir of Fortitude before getting Threat Buffs, ex:  Juju Might. (see Defensive Buffs). Consumables not only give Buffs but some have instant effects, ex: Goblin Sapper Charge, Major Healthstone, Dark Rune among others.

Debuffs

A max of 16 Debuffs can be on a mob. Reaching the max is major in raids. There’s defensive Debuffs:  Insect Swarm & threat Debuffs:  Faerie Fire among others. With the raid leader’s consent, suggest ideal Debuffs without overstepping. We can apply Gift of Arthas & Stormstrike.

Gear

Cement defensive stats when gearing, threat is second. It’s advised to get 4k HP & 5k Armor unbuffed for Molten Core. Blackwing Lair, ~4800 to 5k HP and 6500-7k Armor. For reliable threat, 3% melee Hit is advised for dungeons. For Raid tanking, 6% Melee Hit and 10%-12% Spell Hit, Nat Pagle’s Broken Reel helps. To calculate your threat, use a TPS Simulator. You can only equip a weapon & shield in combat, enabling the swap to a defensive weapon, ex: Spineshatter, if survival seems grim.

Enchants

There are two types of enchants, defensive, ex:  Enchant Gloves – Superior Agility. And offensive, ex:  Enchant Gloves – Threat. Having Enchanting isn’t neded to gain the profession’s advantages. Simply, give the Enchanter the required enchanting materials and they will enchant your gear for a small gold tip.

AOE Tanking

Many actions can further solidify AoE cases, ex:  Oil of Immolation, Thorns,  Force Reactive Disk, etc… (see list) It’s crucial to switch and attack another target ever so often. In combat, items & spells giving health or mana deal 50% threat divided by each mob. Items also help until a decent amount of threat is gained on all mobs, ex: Masterwork Target Dummy.

Raid Composition

With the raid leader’s consent, offer an ideal raid comp but don’t overstep. In our group, Warlock: Blood Pact, Warrior:  Battle Shout, Druid: Leader of the Pack, Hunter: Trueshot Aura. For damage dealing classes, we prefer ranged classes over melee. If melee are needed, rogues are best. Groups with high threat dealers can have a Shaman: Tranquil Air Totem.

TBC Prep

The Burning Crusade “TBC” is looming and being prepared is wise. A lot of gold is an asset, since there are many different gear sets needing: repair, enchants & gems. You’ll also need: potions, bind on equip gear, etc… Building a reputation on your realm helps open doors in the future as players will recognise you. Next, find a guild welcoming of your future tanking.

Have Questions?

Ask me live: https://www.twitch.tv/caperfin

 

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Quaria
1 year ago

Nice read. I love the thought off non-cookie cutter builds. Lot’s of undefined items/spells for me, will read it through once more when the undefined is fixed. ̶B̶y̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶w̶a̶y̶,̶ ̶w̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶i̶s̶ ̶W̶e̶a̶v̶e̶r̶ ̶P̶r̶i̶e̶s̶t̶?̶ Edit: Shadow weaving, I get it now.

centurion
1 year ago

This is a great guide, very interesting!

Nymis
1 year ago

Interesting guide but has this ever been attempted in a raid or is it just for dungeons at best?

Firelord
1 year ago

It is definitely something I will work towards on the side, possibly to help dungeon groups if there are no other tanks around, because I think it could prove a lot of fun. Great guide!

Krannok
1 year ago

This looks amazing! Currently at work, so I don’t have the time currently to read it entirely, but I’m really curious. Will definitely read later!

Good job!

fendor
1 year ago

Before even reading: thank you. I dreamed about a guide like this. I tried so many time to do a leveling shaman to tank some dungeons here and there (no raiding in my goals) and usually hitted a wall with people not wanting me as a tank. This guide will only reinforce my dream 🙂 Shaman ALT incoming for sure!

Gensei
1 year ago

What’s interesting is the last time I played and leveled in Vanlla, me and my 5 man group experimented with double tank comps in certain dungeons that had really tough pulls, and it was too much damage for one tank to take. Maybe this only works if you have a druid healer with strong HoTs, but it was me (a bear druid) and the other guy was a prot warrior. And it worked really really well, clearing packs that we wiped on previously.

So I’d be curious if this kind of shaman build would be viable for 5 mans. It would do more damage than a prot warrior and give buffs to the rest of the party. But maybe double tank in 5 mans is just dumb, and even if it isn’t, a druid healer is the only thing that makes it viable.

So yeah, that’s a long-winded way of saying this seems super cool, and it’s clear that Blizzard at least thought about enhancement being a tank spec to mirror protection, but the only place I can see this working, especially at low gear levels, is in 5 man content. I feel like without this god-tier gear shown in the guide, this entire gimmick just falls apart.

Gensei
1 year ago

Before even reading: thank you. I dreamed about a guide like this. I tried so many time to do a leveling shaman to tank some dungeons here and there (no raiding in my goals) and usually hitted a wall with people not wanting me as a tank. This guide will only reinforce my dream 🙂 Shaman ALT incoming for sure!

See my post after yours. I think it can be viable as a second tank/buffer/dps in 5 man groups. Not sure about raids.

Syturio
1 year ago

I have been waiting for this for ages, finally a good & detailed guide for Shaman Tanking.
Something interesting to read when I am bored at work 🙂
Thanks Devner

Minorou
1 year ago

A valid case can be made for also having a lvl 1 alt stationed permanently in a major city to disenchant unwanted items through mail and store items at a bank for later use.
Pardon me if I’m wrong, but isn’t there a level 5 requirement to get professions such as enchanting?

Aside from that, I’m quite impressed! A lovely guide! :biggrin:

Nymis
1 year ago

Interesting guide but has this ever been attempted in a raid or is it just for dungeons at best?

@Nymis Shamans tanking has grown tremendously since Vanilla. They can tank the majority of raid bosses out there. I was capable of reaching AQ, just before the server I was playing on was closed. Keep in mind, I was not using special event buffs. With these buffs, I would confidently see myself tanking NAXX.

Have a nice day :mrgreen:

Yeah, that’s fair, it’s just that I can’t seem to find a single video of that or any proof of it happening, private server or otherwise – in anything other than a dungeon setting. Maybe it’s just me not looking long enough but I find it hard to believe this actually happened without some proof.

Cleavis
1 year ago

Place a Mana Spring Totem (it gives threat to you)

Mana Spring Totem isn’t supposed to cause threat.

http://evilempireguild.org/guides/kenco2.ph p" rel="nofollow ugc"> https://web.archive.org/web/20070105001753/http://evilempireguild.org/guides/kenco2.php
“for example mana from Blessing of Wisdom or a Mana Spring totem doesnt cause threat”

Gensei
1 year ago

Before even reading: thank you. I dreamed about a guide like this. I tried so many time to do a leveling shaman to tank some dungeons here and there (no raiding in my goals) and usually hitted a wall with people not wanting me as a tank. This guide will only reinforce my dream 🙂 Shaman ALT incoming for sure!

See my post after yours. I think it can be viable as a second tank/buffer/dps in 5 man groups. Not sure about raids.

@Gensei Shamans tanking has grown tremendously since Vanilla. They can tank the majority of raid bosses out there. I was capable of reaching AQ, just before the server I was playing on was closed. Keep in mind, I was not using special event buffs. With these buffs, I would confidently see myself tanking NAXX.

Have a nice day :mrgreen:

Do you have a gear list of what you were using in MC?

Sanniey
1 year ago

I have no time to read right now, but well definitely look into this as I’m probably going to main a Shaman in Classic! Thanks 1000x!!!

Mizu
1 year ago

For anyone wondering, none of this is even remotely necessary to tank 5-mans or even early raids. For much of the game, Shaman threat exceeds that of Warriors rather effortlessly, and their survivability isn’t as much of an issue as you might expect. Don’t feel as though this is something you have to wait until AQ40/Naxx BIS before hoping to attempt, as you can (and honestly should) start collecting tank gear as early on as possible and be prepared to fill the role when needed throughout your leveling journey.

Interesting guide but has this ever been attempted in a raid or is it just for dungeons at best?

@Nymis Shamans tanking has grown tremendously since Vanilla. They can tank the majority of raid bosses out there. I was capable of reaching AQ, just before the server I was playing on was closed. Keep in mind, I was not using special event buffs. With these buffs, I would confidently see myself tanking NAXX.

Have a nice day :mrgreen:

Yeah, that’s fair, it’s just that I can’t seem to find a single video of that or any proof of it happening, private server or otherwise – in anything other than a dungeon setting. Maybe it’s just me not looking long enough but I find it hard to believe this actually happened without some proof.

Here’s a video of my guild’s third Vael kill. There’s no footage of the first one, so you’ll have to take my word for it when I say I was the first tank on that as well. ZG was open prior to BWL on the server, but I used no gear from it on this fight.

I’ve tanked every leveling 5-man at the appropriate level as well as each 60 dungeon, UBRS included, significantly undergeared (I repeated this on The Rebirth as well as Kronos 2, with comparable success). I’ve also offtanked MC, BWL and ZG progression, sometimes main tanking fights where the extra threat generation could be taken advantage of. I’m also a huge slacker and cut lots of corners. I can personally answer any questions about the viability of progression tanking at those stages, beyond which I don’t know enough to really comment on.

I’m also new to this forum; saw a Shaman tanking thread and couldn’t help myself.
Cool stuff btw OP. :mrgreen:

Rinkusan
1 year ago

I can’t believe what I just read, I’m into this kind of shit.
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abyss
1 year ago

Hello Caperfin!

Amazing guide; I’ve read this over a few times and come back often in my theorycrafting for my own build, where I want to find a balance between tanking, PvP and DPS (Totem Twisting, Nightfall bot, probably).

I am wondering about the importance of the talent Toughness, specifically versus Weapon Mastery.

I imagine that Weapon Mastery is quite good for PvP, and will help with threat generation during tanking, but I would be forgoing Toughness for this, which means lowering my EHP.

Is Toughness’ mitigation percentage substancial overall?

I am playing around with a few builds right now, so I don’t have just one to link for context, but the essence of my dilemma is written above.

Thank you for the marvelous guide!

Mizu
1 year ago

Hello Caperfin!

Amazing guide; I’ve read this over a few times and come back often in my theorycrafting for my own build, where I want to find a balance between tanking, PvP and DPS (Totem Twisting, Nightfall bot, probably).

I am wondering about the importance of the talent Toughness, specifically versus Weapon Mastery.

I imagine that Weapon Mastery is quite good for PvP, and will help with threat generation during tanking, but I would be forgoing Toughness for this, which means lowering my EHP.

Is Toughness’ mitigation percentage substancial overall?

I am playing around with a few builds right now, so I don’t have just one to link for context, but the essence of my dilemma is written above.

Thank you for the marvelous guide!

When you need to compromise but have your sights set on tanking and PvP, Toughness > Weapon Mastery.

Weapon Mastery is mainly important for DPSing since it’s a 10% damage increase to your white hits, which is all you’d really be using in a raid setting. For holding aggro, white hits could make up anywhere from 20-50% of your threat generation depending on how much earth shocking you’re doing (the far end of that spectrum being literally none), which means a 2-5% increase overall for 5 talent points. You’d get more bang for your buck with a really strong weapon from BWL and later when the weapon damage starts to outweigh the invisible additive from Rockbiter, but it’s still not enough to warrant losing all that extra armor. The extra mitigation from Toughness is a huge deal considering survivability is your main weakness relative to other tanking classes.

PvP Enhance is kind of a meme, and when you’re getting those triple Windfury crits, your target is dead anyway so that extra 10% would be overkill. Yeah you’re not always getting Windfury procs, but your basic melee swing feels like it might as well be doing zero damage so you won’t ever notice that teensy increase.

eKyNoX
1 year ago

Woohoo, Thanks Caperfin, tell us when complete!

Which parts have to be changed?

TJourney
1 year ago

I can help with some of those from testing back in vanilla:

Vanish wipes threat and has no resist chance.

Flask of Petrification prevents movement, attacking, and spell casting – but you become immune to damage. It does not wipe threat, but you cannot have aggro unless there are no other targets on the threat table or you have the enemy taunted. Enemies will ignore you and go after other targets on the threat table.

Limited Invulnerability Potion works like Blessing of Protection – enemies which deal physical damage will ignore you and go after other targets on the threat table. It does not modify or reset your threat or threat generation, you will continue to generate threat while under the effect, and can potentially gain aggro once the effect ends if this puts you in 1st with 110% or 130% of whoever has aggro.

Stfuppercut
1 year ago

I just want to see some video footage of Enhance Shaman tanking during progression. I’m not interested in a fully geared team carrying a poor tank. I want to see this spec working during progression to see if its actually viable or not.

Selexin
1 year ago

I just want to see some video footage of Enhance Shaman tanking during progression. I’m not interested in a fully geared team carrying a poor tank. I want to see this spec working during progression to see if its actually viable or not.

I don’t think Shaman can tank progression fights in raids. I think maybe prot paladin can do some progression stuff but not well. Like you say, it would still be interesting to see some videos of attempts etc.

I like the idea of shaman tanks. But they were unfortunately just not designed to tank raids. They were designed as a backup/emergency tank in certain dungeon situations. They weren’t intended to soak crushing blows from patchwerk. Caster tanks wearing mail are a cool concept, but they are missing key ingredients. They suffer from the hybrid tax. Druids are good at healing and tanking. Shamans are good at healing, and elemental PvP. Paladins are good at healing…. prot has some utility in tanking dungeons, but are pretty harshly hybrid taxed.

Stfuppercut
1 year ago

I don’t think Shaman can tank progression fights in raids. I think maybe prot paladin can do some progression stuff but not well. Like you say, it would still be interesting to see some videos of attempts etc.

I like the idea of shaman tanks. But they were unfortunately just not designed to tank raids. They were designed as a backup/emergency tank in certain dungeon situations. They weren’t intended to soak crushing blows from patchwerk. Caster tanks wearing mail are a cool concept, but they are missing key ingredients. They suffer from the hybrid tax. Druids are good at healing and tanking. Shamans are good at healing, and elemental PvP. Paladins are good at healing…. prot has some utility in tanking dungeons, but are pretty harshly hybrid taxed.

I agree. And if that is the case, they are not viable as tanks so conversations about enhance tanking are silly. Because technically anything can tank with the right amount of heals and gear. People will just spam them to death while they rock every consume in the game… This doesnt make it viable.

When considering if something is viable, we should ask ourselves if these things are worth doing.

Selexin
1 year ago

When considering if something is viable, we should ask ourselves if these things are worth doing.

Worth doing is subjective. People do get enjoyment out of a mage tanking an encounter, because it’s “breaking the rules”. It’s certainly not optimal, and obviously if it ‘works’ you could call it viable, but in that case nearly anything is viable.

I won’t stop anyone from trying these things – but they certainly aren’t going to become mainstream, optimal, or overly viable to the normal player. They will provide enjoyment and engagement from a part of the community, so it is what it is I guess.

Stfuppercut
1 year ago

Worth doing is subjective… or overly viable to the normal player.

I get what youre saying, but this is where conversations become unproductive when discussing what is or isnt viable. “Overly viable”? Being viable should not be a fluid state that is left to interpretation. It is either viable, can work in progression and thus is worth doing or it is not viable. Youre entirely right that this is subjective, which is why so many guys play as sub optimal builds and nerf their teams performance to enhance their own personal experience through selfish play.

All content can be downed with 39 players and thus everything could be considered viable by definition, but I dont think that is realistic or applicable within the context of determining if a specific spec should be brought into a team.

Mizu
1 year ago

I just want to see some video footage of Enhance Shaman tanking during progression. I’m not interested in a fully geared team carrying a poor tank. I want to see this spec working during progression to see if its actually viable or not.

They’re viable as an OT who drops totems, and while MTing is certainly possible (the line between OT and MT is often blurred in MC), it’s really not a great idea for most bosses. I can give you a real-ass take on how it pans out on any fight BWL or lower.

Stfuppercut
1 year ago

They’re viable as an OT who drops totems, and while MTing is certainly possible (the line between OT and MT is often blurred in MC), it’s really not a great idea for most bosses. I can give you a real-ass take on how it pans out on any fight BWL or lower.

I want to see this done – during progression. Even if it is possible… Why? Why gear and bring someone who is only capable of situationally offtanking? Thats dumb.

Mizu
1 year ago

They’re viable as an OT who drops totems, and while MTing is certainly possible (the line between OT and MT is often blurred in MC), it’s really not a great idea for most bosses. I can give you a real-ass take on how it pans out on any fight BWL or lower.

I want to see this done – during progression. Even if it is possible… Why? Why gear and bring someone who is only capable of situationally offtanking? Thats dumb.

Full time OT (think second or third tank). High burst threat on the first mob you kill helps smooth out fights in early endgame, and it’s pretty easy to snag stray trash when one of your main threat generators has a 20 yard range. They can do MC in pre-raid BiS and they’re not exactly stealing gear meant for other classes.
Great FR tanking as well; being able to gear around your own fire res totem makes it pretty easy to cap out without gimping yourself too hard, plus you got a 10% fire/frost/nature reduction talent and a spell redirect on a short cooldown.

Casual/Semi-casual guilds are also just happy to field more Shammies period. Not saying it’s optimal, but it can be and has been done. It’ll be a lot easier to do on Classic too considering how much less everything hurts compared to private servers.
Only video I have is the Vael one I linked earlier in the thread.

Stfuppercut
1 year ago

Only video I have is the Vael one I linked earlier in the thread.

Yeah, I’d be super interested in seeing it used during progression to see if its viable or not.

Mizu
1 year ago

Only video I have is the Vael one I linked earlier in the thread.

Yeah, I’d be super interested in seeing it used during progression to see if its viable or not.

I would mostly just be worried if I had to tank Golemagg as his earthquaking would give me a goddamn heart attack.
Magmadar could also be a bit dicey. I mean it’s the kind of fight where everything generally goes fine but I’m actually sweating profusely at the thought of him being enraged for slightly too long.
Grabbing aggro back after a Shazzrah blink could get mana-intensive; the constant resets mean you can’t frontload your threat in a huge burst and spend time regenerating, so you might need an innervate.

Everything else is pretty easy to tank because it’s MC. I’d love to try and demonstrate that if I can make room in my schedule to raid this time around, because I know that my anecdotal experience doesn’t amount to all that much. It’s not something I think could become a new meta or anything lofty like that, but I feel that a Shaman tank’s success serves to deconstruct the conventional wisdom of raid tanking and kinda naturally lends itself to the train of thought that brought us DW fury tanks. Warriors also really like not competing with you for loot.

Daidalos
1 year ago

Hi, great job putting this comprehensive guide together.

I’m just a newbie when it comes to wow classic so not everything was easy to understand for me.
Although i’m bold enough to start a shamy alt that can tank dungeons.

I have no aspiration of tanking raids so i got a good feeling not everything is mandatory for dungeon tanking what you listed.

My aim is to do the dungeon runs with pug not only with friends. So would be great to have a dungeon leveling section with talent progression, with stat priorities.

When i read the talent sections it didnt make sense to me to have 5percent more mana and not to have the shield spec when admittedly the greatest weakness of the class is the dam reduction.

Moomaul
1 year ago

Why is Stormstrike taken? High mana cost and cooldown.

Also, can a 0/30/21 spec work for dungeon tanking or healing? Not raiding.

Moomaul
1 year ago

What talents would you suggest for a 0/30/21 dungeon tanking/healing build? Or would 0/31/20 be better? I’m just looking for something flexible for gearing up and getting into dungeons faster.

Choffer
1 year ago

First of all, thanks for keeping the guide up to date.

A more general question, what made you shift from a more avoidance oriented version as in the past to armor/sta/SP gear?
I understand that a tank’s biggest limitation nowadays its going to be threat generation and keeping up with the dps since we don’t have that magic taunt to work with. I really like this version to just increase spell dmg for threat. However, do you not face problems given the lack of +%spell hit and +%hit?
Something I want to try out in the future once I have the PVP gear is to just run my normal ele/resto build with tank gear. Thinking of 3% melee/spell hit + 5% crit + NS + 25%armor buff (if eye of storm procs and threat is not needed) vs. 5% dodge 5+%parry and flurry should be equivalent for dungeon tanking.

For weapons:
The axe Serathil could be a very good option instead of the Timeworn mace for orcs. 20Armor 11Sta vs. 3% hit
Comparing Spineshatter with Timeworn mace on ph3?
A note, 15agy on weapon is only available on ph3+.

Cloak:
I personally would prefer Shifting Cloak to Cloak of warding. +0.85% crit +1.85%dodge +8sta vs. +132armor +5 Def

Shield:
Given that your focusing most of your threat from spells wouldn’t Malistar’s Defender be a better choice? 180mana and 9mp5 vs some hp and armor

Trinkets:
Almost no shaman will go for Mark of Tyranny. What other trinkets would you recommend for phase2+? I was thinking of Mark of the chosen/Briarwood Reed/AV trinket

Choffer
1 year ago

I see your point towards armor value.
Exactly my opinion with Shifting Cloak. As long as we using Rank13 gear or similar it is a better choice than guardian cloack.

With Malistar, I’m questioning how it is not superior to rank14 shield for almost any scenario. It has less armor yes, but can make up for it with extra threat potential.

It is a fact dungeon tanking can be done with any spec given the proper gear. But lets move to raid tanking, how does spell hit not play a major role here? A max rank ES/CL resisted will be a major loss on threat and mana wasted.

TheGreatShambino
1 year ago

Hi! Love the guide! I’m currently running 11/40/0 with 2/2 guardian, 2/2 enhancing totems, and 2h specialization simply for versatility. My guild is actually considering letting me tank some MC, and I was looking to get some feedback on what I should switch out of in order to get 3/3 elemental warding. I’m strongly considering taking the three talent points from 2h specialization and going 3/5 weapon mastery.

My reasoning behind keeping guardian totems is that I want to take as little damage as possible so that I am invited to tank again, I don’t foresee having threat issues because I will not be main tanking, and I also have Hand of Edward the Odd as my weapon, which is fast, hits relatively hard, and the proc will be used to induce even more threat (not to mention the increased spell dmg to es/fs due to the added int!). Thanks in advance!

TheGreatShambino
1 year ago

I would go from 5/5 weapon mastery to 3/5*

Perdition
1 year ago

This is a truly excellent Guide. Many thanks. I did alot of Shammy tanking years ago and it was one of the single most fun experiences I’ve ever had. Glad to see word is out!

Largid
1 year ago

Very good guide, I’ve used it numerous times to elaborate my own opinion on Shaman Tanking.

Right now I’m RL and MT in 3rd static of my guild in MC, 5/10. Going pretty well, my overall effective HP is combarable to warriors in my static.
Only real problem on most bosses is lack of “oh shi…” button while warriors have number of those.

Classic is all about experiments, after all.
Thanks for you guide and having unpopular opinion while using facts to your defense, not concepts.

Largid
1 year ago

By the way, It would be really great if you could make a BIS phase gear w/o PVP gear, simply because it’s much harder to get then most of raid epics. I see it on phase 2 and 3, but not on later ones.

TheGreatShambino
1 year ago

So I did a little bit of research, and some math. It turns out that The Hand of Edward the odd has a ‘timer’ of once per minute. The way that is normalized by swing is through weapon speed, 1.6seconds, coming out to 2.667% proc chance per swing. But when we’re comparing the threat to the Majordomo dagger you mentioned the once per minute is more important. Both items have the same rockbiter threat modifier because they are the same speed. The dagger gets an additional 2.5 Dps/tps from the attack power, bringing the threat/per second up to about 53 tps, while Edward sits at 45 tps, without the proc. Now you convert the proc chance into what you can do with the instant cast every minute, and thus convert it to tps. In order to make up the 8 tps difference between the two weapons, all you need to do is heal yourself for 16hps, 16×60=960. Healing wave rank 8 more than does the trick, as it heals for 1040 to 1191, putting you just over the tps you’d generate using the dagger. However it will cost 440 mana each team

TLDR: the tps difference between Corehound Tooth and Edward the odd is 8 tps, you can make up that threat when using Edward the odd’s once per minute proc by using healing wave rank 8 in single target, adding 17.33 to 19.85 hps. Unreliable? Yes. However, for longer fights it opens the door to far more threat generation than that dagger while adding in more survivability on top.

Seeing how those heals compare to the 120 armor from timeworn mace would be interesting to looks at, but it entirely depends on How hard you are being hit and how fast, entirely subjective data.

Timer data in the 2nd comment https://classic.wowhead.com/item=2243/hand-of-edward-the-odd#comments

Largid
1 year ago

I’m actually very surprised you don’t mention Eskhandar’s Right Claw as a weapon in gear list.
I suppose its proc has a very good synergy with RB, because extra TPS doesnt descale with Haste.
If I get this weapon, I’ll try to measure its PPM and added TPS.

Gensei
1 year ago

So I still have my elemental shaman, a troll. I’ve not played in a couple months because of RL stuff. But damn it if shaman tank has always interested me but I can’t envision end-game tanking with my skinny ass troll.

I tanked WC, BFD, and SM Library while leveling, and it was super fun. But I feel like a troll tanking, even as a warrior, feels not quite right.

TheGreatShambino
1 year ago

In my opinion, if someone can’t time an instant cast self heal with their next tick of incoming damage, they likely have other, more pressing, in game problems than managing threat/survivability, and probably shouldn’t be rolling a shaman tank. Maybe for the inexperienced shaman, a different weapon could be better, but with experience using Edward, the threat and survivability are unparalleled until p3. It takes good timing and more experience, but the results are there to be attained. Like other classes and high performance specs with nuance, you just gotta know what you’re doing and practice practice practice!

TheGreatShambino
1 year ago

Hi so about Eskhandar’s, word on the street (warrior community) is that you cannot parry when using this weapon, which effectively ranks it at the very bottom of the totem pole for tanking! 🙁 60% reduced attack speed would be brokenly nice, though.

Edit: HOWEVER… this item will easily keep you in the top echelon of threat generators on fights with a Single tank/bosses immune to taunt, such as Onyxia, essentially making you wipe prevention during the enrage phase of a boss. If the tank dies, just swap it out for your tanking weapon, and you may very well buy your raid the extra 15 or 30 seconds needed to down the boss. Which is priceless, and has a place in all progression guilds.

Pippina
Editor
1 year ago

Hi so about Eskhandar’s, word on the street (warrior community) is that you cannot parry when using this weapon, which effectively ranks it at the very bottom of the totem pole for tanking! 🙁 60% reduced attack speed would be brokenly nice, though.

I’ve heard something similar regarding parry on fist weapons.

Interesting. According to this wowwiki patch notes history for parry, fist weapons were supposedly fixed to allow them to parry just like any other weapon back in patch 1.6:

https://vanilla-wow.fandom.com/wiki/Parry

If that patch history is accurate, then seems like eskhander’s claw should be able to parry.

Pippina
Editor
1 year ago

that might be the case I’ll ask around, I’ve never had a fist weapon, since I got Deathbringer first and most weapons generally outperform fist weapons.

Eshkander’s claw just looks so cool though. So is the claw of the black Drake. Shame they don’t keep up.

Psojed
1 year ago

When selecting item for a given slot, there’s an enchant selection below the items window:comment image

capitano666
11 months ago

Mana Spring Totem: Optimally, put by a shaman with: Restorative Totems. The only totem capable of giving us threat.

Hello there, every other source I’ve read states that mana spring totem does not give any threat, am I missing anything here?

capitano666
11 months ago

Hello there, every other source I’ve read states that mana spring totem does not give any threat, am I missing anything here?

Unless it got silently changed in the last few weeks. You can only get threat from your own Mana Spring Totem.

How would it be supposed to work? I did the following test:
Emptied my mana by self healing
Body pulled a low level mob
Placed mana totem (more than one actually)
asked a priest to punch the mob
The priest actually missed the mob (!) and still got aggro!

Combat log screenshot below (Helki is me, Bleurk is the priest):comment image

capitano666
11 months ago

The threat generated by Mana is half of the amount, so it would be quite low.
I will re-test this and get back to you.
If you have any other questions regarding the guide, feel free to ask.

Hello, have you had any chance to re-test it? From my post above it looked like the threat generation is zero, so I’m using Healing Stream now instead, which also generates zero but at least counts as a little mitigation

capitano666
10 months ago

I have a question regarding the stat weight you give to defensive stats. You give armor a weight of 0.34, agility a weight of 0.9 and dodge a weight of 17

We know that 20 agility gives 1 dodge and 40 armor so according to your weights:
40 armor = 13.6 points
1 dodge = 17 points
20 agility = 18 points…..shouldn’t this be the same as the previous 2 stats together for a total of (13.6+17=) 30.6 points?

Same thing for the “threat” weights, with a weight of 0.6 per point 20 agility give 12 points, but 1 crit is weighted 10 instead of 12

Pippina
Editor
7 months ago

Well somebody finally did it

39 man all-shaman MC raid

starring multiple shaman tanks.

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