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Should Tanks charge for Tanking 5-man's?

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Gensei
(@gensei)
Reputable Member

I mean if you want to charge, you're free to. But I'm never grouping with a tank that's charging. Just my preference.

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Posted : 18/09/2019 5:12 pm
Selexin
(@selexin)
Prominent Member

You're entitled to how you spend your time in-game, and you should certainly state your requirements up front.

I completely agree that you need to make your intentions clear up front. Having said that, saying that you will charge DPS/Healers repair bills for deaths will probably reduce your invites to lower than what they were as a DPS looking for a group. Your experience wasn't the average experience, and has probably left you jaded. Typically you will run dungeons without deaths, or maybe 1 or 2 at worst. You will regularly clear dungeons with no wipes and collect plenty of loot to vendor to more than cover any repair bills.

End game you can certainly be a little more... entitled. Like others have said you can reserve items/consumables to cover your supply/demand costs and your time/repair bills.

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Posted : 18/09/2019 5:22 pm
gallow
(@gallow)
Reputable Member

If you are charging for a dungeon, then you should be selling a service. Similar to mages selling portals / food, or selling profession cooldowns.

This means that you are professional, well geared, and know what you are doing. This also implies that you don't really get anything out of that dungeon, so you are purely doing it for the rest of the group.

Mid-level zone issue
I can't see people paying for a tank below level 45-50 zones. They are just easy to do with ANY warrior (heck even a 2H one), plus many are most likely broke from buying their first mount.

RFD+ things get a bit trickier. If the tank selling a service has no use of the drops from the dungeon, then we assume they are overgeared/overleveled for that place. Let us assume a level 50 well-geared tank is selling Maraudon full clear, for 2g per person. Assuming that all 4 players are willing to buy the service, that is 8g earned (+drops). Now a full Maraudon clear is probably gonna take you 1 hour. Is doing something that has little value to your character for 8g+drops worth it? I mean, I much rather be questing as Arms when I can earn more XP + probably better gold.

Obviously you'll still get many people around those levels giving you the middle finger for asking 2g for "doing your job", so there's that as well.

Endgame dungeons
By endgame I mean BRD/Strat/Scholo/U&LBRS. So we are still assuming you need no gear from these places.
How much are you charging at this rate, and is it worth your time? Lets say 10g per run. That's 40g. Is it REALLY worth your time to charge 40g for a dungeon at max level..? This is still assuming people will pay you 10g for a run.

As written by others as well, I think it's more common to reserve an item. First orb drop for strat-live, for instance. Or doing groups by "reserving" an item (not for yourself), only to sell it to someone else. Again I think it feels somewhat icky.

I think at the end, the demand is going to create a market for this. Not the supply.
If people are going to say "LF TANK X DUNGEON PAYING 10G PER PERSON!", you can bet that there will be a supply.
If tanks just start saying "OFFERING TANKING X DUNGEON 10G PER PERSON" they will get ridiculed on trade/world chat, so I can see some people not wanting that associated with their characters.

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Posted : 18/09/2019 5:44 pm
Stfuppercut
(@stfuppercut)
Noble Member

This depends on the market. If a tank can charge for the run and fills his group - its fair to charge. If its not fair, people wouldnt join. The same logic can be applied to any reserves or anything else. So long as the tank is clear about his intentions before the run, and people join the group and accept those terms - the terms are fair. If people disagree, they wont join and therefore the run wont take place.

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Posted : 18/09/2019 8:28 pm
Caspus
(@caspus)
Estimable Member

Everyone's entitled to do anything they want in the game, doesn't mean I won't voice my opinion about it.

Personally as a Tank, both warrior and paladin I feel its my duty to serve my guild for 5-mans, as well as friends and my server.

Tanks who demand payment upfront I just find greedy as hell. I personally don't feel or see where this entitlement comes from unless you're litterally being forced to respec. I've never supported or interacted with these kind of people.

Now there is usually group ettique when it comes to your tanks. Their repair bills are usually pretty high. Sometimes doubleing if not trippling your average clothie dps. If the run goes south it's usually fair to tip the tank or allow the tank to snag a piece of vendor loot that can cover the repair bill and maybe a little more.

I also donate light-consumes to people who are tanking for me.

I also believe in giving the tank the first orb in Strat live is also a fair deal and fair incentive for tanks to come help out in that particular instance.

Tanks are not having a hard time making money, its extremely easy. Specailly as most warriors are geared to the teeth and can solo farm majority of their consumes with ease. So if a warrior selling their body uses "this is the only way i can make gold" then they're covering up the fact that they're lazy.

Also if you're going to be charging a premium at all. Actually be geared aswell as be good at tanking. I knew a lot of tanks on private servers that tried to cash grab this way but cant properly tank at the very least.

TDLR: If you sit in ironforge all day spamming "pay me to play the game" you're a lazy bastard.

Also if you're on deviate delight and you find yourself stuck on the possibility of having to pay for a Tank, check to see if I am on. "Casp" i'll tank any 50-60 dungeon for free if i'm not currently busy or tanking already.

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Posted : 18/09/2019 10:48 pm
killerduki
(@killerduki)
Estimable Member

Join my runs in EU Skullflame Alliance, all runs for free and you will enjoy them too ;).

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Posted : 19/09/2019 6:58 am
daisyKutter
(@daisykutter)
Estimable Member

Join my runs in EU Skullflame Alliance, all runs for free and you will enjoy them too ;).

He is not looking for a tank, he is the tank charging the money.

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Posted : 19/09/2019 7:08 am
Zacheous
(@zacheous)
Estimable Member

Really? Are you going to pay the healer that keeps you alive to tank? How about the DPS' that are damaging the heck out of the mob while you stand there and try to hold aggro? Here's some advice go run the dungeon alone with your big badder than everyone else tank and see how long you make it without others to help. Bad players are bad players, it happens so just get over it. Maybe you aren't that great either if you have problems holding aggro. Ever think about that?

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Posted : 20/09/2019 8:29 am
Telvaine
(@telvaine)
Reputable Member

Really? Are you going to pay the healer that keeps you alive to tank? How about the DPS' that are damaging the heck out of the mob while you stand there and try to hold aggro? Here's some advice go run the dungeon alone with your big badder than everyone else tank and see how long you make it without others to help. Bad players are bad players, it happens so just get over it. Maybe you aren't that great either if you have problems holding aggro. Ever think about that?

I love how incredulous some people get about this concept. If mages can charge for portals, then why can't warriors charge for tanking? They are providing you a service. Blizzard has been paying people to tank random dungeons for like 4 expansions now using the group finder's "vital role" reward system or whatever tf it's called. This may shock you, but a lot of warriors would rather dps than tank. They are giving up some fun to make the dungeon work. I will personally never pay for a tank, but that's my choice. It's the same concept as reserving gear in dungeons. Some people get all bent out of shape over it, but it's a logical way of forming a group. You end up with a group of people that self selected because they don't care about whatever gear you are reserving. They get to run the dungeon, and you get no competition for your loot.

Will charging for tanking probably make it a lot harder for you to find a group? Absolutely. I would laugh my way right on to the next group if anyone tried to charge for a run. But is it morally wrong to charge for providing tanking services? Absolutely not. And Zach, the reason no one is ever going to pay a healer and especially not dps is because you are not providing a service, as there is an effectively infinite supply of dps, because the majority of players find that role more fun. I would be absolutely shocked if you ever found anyone willing to pay for dps. I would not be surprised to see people paying for a tank, because there is and always has been a shortage of tanks. That's the World of Warcraft we play.

Edit: Ya know what? You've inspired me to do a little social experimentation now. I'm going to level my warrior alt enough for Deadmines and WC and see how difficult it is to find a group if I charge for tanking.

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Posted : 20/09/2019 9:27 am
Telvaine
(@telvaine)
Reputable Member

If mages can charge for portals, then why can't warriors charge for tanking? They are providing you a service.

That isn't really equivalent.
A mage gets 0 benefit from opening a portal for you unless you pay them.
Tanks may be more in demand than the other roles, but they need to run dungeons just as much as everyone else does.
no one is ever going to pay a healer and especially not dps is because you are not providing a service

There is no logical difference between the "service" a DPS or healer provides and the "service" and tank provides.
The fact that fewer people are willing to tank than DPS or heal doesn't make what they do a service.

There is equivalence there. It's not exactly the same, but at the end of the day, people need portals, and people need tanks. That's what matters, supply and demand. Mages have the only supply of portals. Classes that can tank have the only supply of tanking ability. Again, I'm not going to pay for a tank, but if people can get away with charging to tank then why shouldn't they?

There is a logical difference between the service a dps or healer provide and the service a tank provides. Again, it's supply and demand. There is no demand for dps, because the supply is effectively infinite. No demand = no value. Healers are much more in demand than dps, and if a healer wanted to charge I don't see why they shouldn't, except that the supply to demand ratio for healers is much less drastic than for tanks, so I find it much less likely that players would be willing to pay for a healer.

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Posted : 20/09/2019 10:48 am
Telvaine
(@telvaine)
Reputable Member

Bruh all I'm saying is that I wouldn't be surprised if people were able to charge for tanking, and if they can get away with it there is no reason they shouldn't. The fact that the supply of dps is far more than 3x the demand is what makes it effectively infinite, and therefore valueless. As I've been saying the entire thread, I'm not paying for a tank, and I wouldn't recommend it if you are trying to get a quick group, but if you can successfully do it then there is nothing wrong with doing so.

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Posted : 20/09/2019 11:21 am
Caspus
(@caspus)
Estimable Member

(Im a tank so personally I won't ever have to deal with this) but if I wasn't, or was playing a dps or healer I won't on principle pay someone to play the game.

If my group for some reason pays for a tank he better be a hot shit because if he sucks im blacklisting and will let my guild and friends know about it.

That being said, more power to the individual. You play how ever you want to play regardless of anyones, including myself, opinion on the matter.

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Posted : 20/09/2019 11:57 am
Steerclear
(@steerclear)
Trusted Member

As a tank, I just don't want to be known as the price gouging jackass who won't tank unless someone pays him an exorbitant fee. I enjoy tanking.

That being said, I'm 53. I'm not done gearing out. Once I've geared out and I'm looting MC purples, I can see running things like Strat or Scholo for the 25th time getting tiresome. But there's always the whole concept of saying, "I just kinda don't feel like it, sorry."

Basically, if someone offers, I still feel kinda guilty accepting. That's why I could never own a business in real life. I feel bad charging people for something I enjoy doing.

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Posted : 20/09/2019 1:53 pm
ClassicRaids
(@classicraids)
Trusted Member

There are various options. Charging is the most straight forward one, but there are other options. As mentioned, you can reserve the first Righteous Orb drop but you can reserve other things as well. If you have mining or herbalism, you can reserve nodes. You can also request that you receive any greens / blues that aren't needed by anyone (rolling need last if nobody else rolls need. Ask before you do this of course!) You can then either DE, AH, or vendor them which should add up over the course of a dungeon run.

Because of the high demand, in addition to the high repair costs, these are very reasonable request to make. Don't be afraid to require some or all of these, you'll find that many people will be very willing to do so, especially after spending 30+ min trying to find a tank. After all, most players run dungeons for 1) experience, 2) upgrades, and 3) quests. There aren't that many that run dungeons with the main focus of making gold.

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Posted : 21/09/2019 10:37 am
mookey
(@mookey)
Eminent Member

- Tanking is not a service, its a role. Therefore it shouldn't be paid/charged while leveling / early gearing.
- Fully raid geared tank, tanking a 5-man may charge it, but it is more of a boost than paying for a role.

On the other hand, it is interesting idea how to keep players until the end of the run. When you do MC trash farm early on for rep, or MC pugs you keep players by keeping BoE drops until the end of the raid and roll for them then. Interesting thing to implement would be that tank will keep all BoE drops to himself until the end of the run and roll them off at the end.

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Posted : 22/09/2019 2:25 am
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